Episode Show Notes
Our guest in this episode is Physiotherapist, Pilates teacher, Gyrotonics teacher and Breathability practitioner, Jakki Tobin from the Pilates Centre Mosman in Sydney.
[01:15] Jakki describes how she discovered Pilates while working as a newly qualified physiotherapist in the late 90s at a London teaching hospital. She tried some mat classes held on site and was blown away.
[03:40] Bruce and Jakki contrast knowing anatomy intellectually with their reactions to experiencing Pilates in their own bodies.
[06:05] Jakki’s training and integration of Pilates into everything else she was doing and how her family and fellow physiotherapists reacted.
[08:37] Jakki recalls her shock at discovering how inflexible her shoulders were and how the effect of working on them under the guidance of a Pilates instructor, eased her headaches.
[11:09] Jakki says there were no negatives to her training, but she did feel the odd one out amongst the ballerinas.
[13:17] Jakki lists some of the people who inspired her along her journey – fellow Pilates and Gyrotonic instructors, and Mollie Joyce who partnered with her to buy into the Pilates Centre Mosman.
[16:14] Jakki talks about her studio – its history, the variety in the clients and how it is a beautiful space where people can grow in confidence, and how the diversity means she is never bored.
[18:57] Bruce and Jakki recall their shared Gyrotonics training.
[19:34] Jakki explains the roadblocks along the way when clients don’t “get it” and how her search for new skills led to Gyrotonics and then learning about breathing.
[21:59] “Pure Pilates” for Jakki is connecting with the mind and body.
[23:25] Her breath journey began with a five-day physiotherapy course that was not what she was expecting.
[26:25] Bruce asks about the changes Jakki has experienced through breath work and Jakki mentions better sleep, more energy and easy breathing when running.
[29:14] The biggest turning point for Jakki was the commitment of buying a studio.
[31:02] The changes in Jakki that she couldn’t have imagined at the start of her movement journey have been the mind body connection, tuning into a deeper part of self and having more tolerance of others and empathy.
[33:21] Jakki’s plans for the future have been shaped by all the changes that have happened in the last few years like COVID. With the help of Shani Morton and the team, Jakki has taken the business in new directions. Online learning and teaching and the effect of COVID on what time clients want to exercise, has created more opportunities.
[35:47] Bruce wraps up by asking what advice Jakki would give her younger self and people starting off in the industry – try everything, work for everyone, watch how each studio operates, discover what you’re naturally good at (you’ll know).
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Episode Transcript
Bruce Hildebrand: In the spirit of respect, The Pilates Diaries Podcast acknowledges the people and elders of the Bunurong people, members of the Kulin Nation, who have traditional connections and responsibilities for the land on which this podcast is produced.
Hi, I’m Bruce Hildebrand and this is the Pilates Diaries Podcast.
The mission of this podcast is to share the stories of the impact of Pilates We’re inviting Pilates enthusiasts to share with us the notes they’ve taken down in their Pilates journey as we seek out the answers to the intrigue Pilates has been able to ignite inside millions all over the world. Our hope is that The Pilates Diaries podcast goes some way to answering the question " What is it that makes Pilates so special?" Join me for privileged peek into this episodes Pilates Diary.
Today we’re joined by Jakki Tobin from the Pilates Centre Mosman in Sydney.
Jakki, welcome to the show.
Jakki Tobin: Thanks Bruce. Thanks for having me
Bruce Hildebrand: We’ll begin by taking a look back. Jakki, can you tell me about life before Pilates? What were your pursuits and where did you see yourself heading at the time? And in hindsight, what was some of the threads perhaps that you now see that led you to discover Pilates?
Jakki Tobin: I discovered Pilates quite early- I was in my early twenties and I was a new Physio a few years out of being a qualified Physio, but I was still doing rotations and unsure about where I wanted to go in Physiotherapy. When you do rotations, you try all different areas, but I was definitely gravitating towards neurology- being a Neuro-Physio, but it wasn’t clear in my mind I was still very much dipping in and out of many things and getting a feel for the whole of Physio. Then I came across Pilates because there was an awesome Pilates instructor who was very bold and came and offered her services at our hospital that we were all teaching it. She came and taught a mat work Pilates in the Physio gym- just for one hour on a Friday lunchtime.
Bruce Hildebrand: And this was back in the UK? I can hear a little lint of a gorgeous English accent?
Jakki Tobin: Yes I grew up in England- even though I was born in Sydney when I was about two, we went back to England. I grew up in England, trained as a Physio in England and did all my rotations there. I did to come out to Australia for about a year on a work and to travel. It was when I went back to London and I was locuming and came across Pilates in the Physio gym at a big teaching hospital. I was on a musculoskeletal rotation, I was doing outpatients that was when I got my first feel for Pilates.
Bruce Hildebrand: Tell me the story of when you first arrived at Pilates and who was this teacher who was so bold to present and give us a sense of the year that this was because it’s always interesting to have a look back at the timeline of when we’ve all touched base with Pilates.
Jakki Tobin: It was in the late nineties and I can pick that because I know that I came back to Australia in early 2000. Pilates was not desperately well-known then- there were only a few studios in London and it wasn’t mainstream at all. So this instructor came and taught in our lunch break on a Friday. I pitched up to it and was blown away. I could not believe this movement that we were doing. It seemed far more intelligent than a lot of the Physio things that I was doing at that time. And I could see immediately how good it felt in my body. And I didn’t have particular skill, but yet I felt great in my body afterwards. As I was on a musculoskeletal rotation, I was straightaway thinking of every single client I was seeing thinking, oh, they don’t need me they need to come to this class, for their term issues and lots of things. So it was an immediate thing for me that I had to know more and I started doing it straight away, but immediately my intention was to get trained in it as well
Bruce Hildebrand: Fascinating to hear those first impressions. I’ve been fortunate to work in amongst Physios for majority of my Pilates teaching career, and I’m always curious to see, particularly for those- and I’m going to put you in that category right away, Jakki, who have a sense of their body and have a sense of movement probably intuitively more than anything is that it tends to speak to you pretty much straight away, and you get a good sense immediately of what the potential of Pilates is.
Jakki Tobin: Totally, because I thought I was a really good mover as a Physio- I did lots of sports, lots of gym, and I was really confident in my body, but doing these Pilates exercises was challenging me in every way. And I hadn’t really thought of moving from the spine before- it was all quite limb orientated and it was very different. And the challenge of it was really appealing as well. I thought I would be a lot better than I was at first. So there were so many things that I knew I wanted to understand more about it. And it’s nice of you to say that I’m a good mover because I’ve never felt like a good mover, but having done Pilates I definitely feel like a better mover now as I approach the big Five-O than I did in my twenties. If I’d carried on moving the same way I was doing before I’d started Pilates I know that I would be feeling a lot more aches and pains and having problems in my body now. So I’m really grateful that I added that to my tools as a Physio, but it was great for my own health and wellbeing as well. And all my family and friends- as a Pilates Instructor or Physio you can’t help but give everyone else a tip and an instruction every now and then, as soon as you see something a little bit dysfunctional.
Bruce Hildebrand: I see there’s lots of parallels there Jakki- I also grew up very athletic through my childhood and played sport at various levels and having come through a sport science degree myself, always was capable and relatively natural at doing arms and legs and I distinctly recount when we had to analyze the spine closely at university I did the calculation around not having to get to know the spinal muscles one by one, and still be able to pass my exam.
Jakki Tobin: Once you feel it and do it you never want to not encourage the spine into the movement. I was talking with a client today and it was the same- she was really getting what the essence of Pilates was, which is always a big moment as a teacher, you’re teaching and suddenly the client is having a massive aha moment. And then together you have to stop everything and you have to talk about it and really honor the moment that you’ve really moved. You haven’t done anything big deal, but your consciousness has moved from being an ordinary mover to now really understanding your movement at the next level.
Bruce Hildebrand: I usually save a high five for those sort of moments with my clients. Tell me about some of the other people in the class that you originally attended in some of those early classes and also the other people in your life at the time- what were some of their perceptions when you told them that you’ve begun this crazy thing called Pilates?
Jakki Tobin: Yeah, that’s such a great question. So I was with fellow Physios and probably a few random nurses and doctors, but it was mainly Physios cause it was in the Physio gym. I was probably the most excited one in the room compared to the others- because I was still looking for my role in Physio and I wasn’t quite sure where I was going with it yet. The class and the movement spoke to me so much and also I could really see how I could help other people with it once I could understand it more- so I definitely was the most excited in the room about it. I pretty quickly went forward and did my training- I don’t even think there were many Physio- Pilates courses at that time. Even if there were, I was pretty committed to doing the Pilates training and I did the two year Pilates Foundation UK course in London. I had a lot of support from family and friends and other Physios, but especially as I then started going into mainly Pilates I was starting to very quickly drift away from pure Physio. Once I started integrating Pilates I couldn’t help but integrate it into every treatment with every person at some point. And then working at Pilates studios and there was a concern from my family of "But shouldn’t you get back to Physio, don’t lose that qualification. They couldn’t quite at first see that it was actually another form of delivering health and wellbeing and also treating clients. I was very much thinking they’re combined- there’s a definite crossover here.
I think it came evident after a few years that I was really embedding myself in Pilates and more of a movement base. And I would say my fellow Physios, quite often, what I definitely remember at the beginning was comments like don’t you get bored of teaching the same exercises all the time, because quite often there would be a routine- you know, Pelvic curl-ups, bent knee fall out, roll down. I remember thinking " Wow! No, I never even thought of it like that because you know, it’s so unique- the relationship you’re having with the person, everything you’re trying to instill in their movement patterns and change. And then you’re trying to change their perception of movement- there’s so many layers, it’s not just how I used to exercise and get taught exercise- do the movement. You’re not just telling them bend your knee, do this. There’s so much more embodiment and encompassment in it, and it takes classes and classes and you’re chipping away at patterns. Some of the physios at first were like " Wow, that’s boring- you’re not using any of your skills". So there was again that misunderstanding- whereas now as Pilates has become more mainstream, there’s more crossover between the two professions.
Bruce Hildebrand: Jakki, can you take us through some of your earliest progress in Pilates, and also the experience of when you first noticed Pilates was starting to have an impact on your life?
Jakki Tobin: Probably one of the things I remember the most- it’s funny how some things never leave you- would be the shock I had at how inflexible my shoulders were, especially after having done Physio for just those few years, and everything’s over the client and obviously all my exercise and sports up to that point, I’d never really understood my shoulders were attached onto my back.
So lying on your tummy with your arms out stretched in front, doing shoulder shrugs with the arm on the bar, on the trap table or on a foam roller. For me, I couldn’t even get my arms onto the foam roller I didn’t have full range and this instructor was trying to tell me, oh, you’ll get there you haven’t got full range. Let me help- putting my arm on. And I remember thinking "Oh my gosh, my arms there- I can’t move it- and she’s now asking me to move my shoulder blades". I didn’t have any pathology, no pain. But gradually week after week, we did the same exercise and sure enough it freed up and totally changed my whole upper back, neck, the headaches I was getting that I was just putting down to " you know, I’ve worked too much today or what have you", it was a really eye-opening moment on the power of the movement, the understanding of the mechanics, the giving the control to me, the client. Not a Physio doing something to someone, but actually having me do all the work for the exercise, but be guided through it. And a range that even as a Physio, I didn’t even know existed, which seems ridiculous. But if you don’t have it, you don’t even know it’s there in your own body.
Bruce Hildebrand: And it’s such a irreplaceable reference when you have that experience in your own movement skillset to share that with such empathy with your clients, I’m sure over the years.
Jakki Tobin: Yes. And I always use that example with clients as the transition pain, it wasn’t pretty to do it felt awful. But it was normal. My body should have been able to do it. The instructor I trusted her and I knew she was checking I was doing it well enough. Sure enough afterwards I would get a bit of ache in that area as it was waking up muscles, but each week it was a little bit less. And within a few weeks, once the movement was there, I’m like, wow, what was even worried about, the body is supposed to do that. That was very insightful. Now I know when I guide people and we talk through something and we’ll go, I think this is transitional pain or it’s a difficulty you’ve got to get through. So it’s knowing what’s a good pain and a bad pain. And giving them obviously ownership on it, but saying you have to get through this, if you want to regain that range. And it’s only normal range, I’m not trying to get you to be a circus performer- this is what your body should do. It’s restoring.
Bruce Hildebrand: Jakki was there a part of the experience that you didn’t like at this stage that you didn’t want to accept or parts of Pilates that you found most challenging in your pursuit of wanting to improve your movements?
Jakki Tobin: There is nothing that jumps out as a real negative. I just remember I was the only Physio on the course and the courses then were very small- six people maximum. They were all ex dancers top level, because the ballet schools- if a dancer could no longer dance, they paid to retrain them and the popular thing to re-train them in at those times was Pilates So there was me- who couldn’t even have full range shoulder, with all these ballerinas with a totally different range of movement. It was good for me to have to deal with the fact that I was the donkey in the room- thinking I’m going to be trained at the same level, and I don’t think my body’s going to be anything like that at the end. But it was great- they were really supportive of me and there were certain exercises in the training because we did so many amazing dance moves in the repertoire that we were learning, that I knew I was never going to do! It was good to be training with them so I could see him enjoy watching them perform and see what the body could do. But I don’t think there was any negatives- it was always really positive, I met great people. That was one thing that made me really feel that I was on the right path because I really enjoyed working with all the clients, the responsibility they were taking in their own bodies and their willingness to learn. I was lucky enough to have a lot of great co-workers and other people in the industry around me at that time in London. And we were small- anyone in London who needed a cover, there was a small base of you that got called- it wasn’t as big as it is now. That’s for sure.
Bruce Hildebrand: I recount one of my early training settings as well- half of the room was dancers, and they were performing phenomenal movements that I’d never observed so closely in my life before, and I was drawn like a moth to a flame to them. They were like "No, no, no, no- don’t worry about that. We want to learn what you’d learned in your Sports Science degree, Bruce". And I’m like " No, no, no- we haven’t got time for that- I want to watch what you guys are doing". So it was a really nice blend, and for me an early exposure to the complimentary nature of having, for example, your next level understanding of the body with Physiotherapy combined with what Pilates has to offer from a movement sense.
Jakki Tobin: Yeah, absolutely.
Bruce Hildebrand: Jakki who was some of the people that you met along the way at this point that really helped shape your Pilates experience?
Jakki Tobin: Well in London I was very lucky to work for the people who ran the Pilates course I was on. They were very inspiring women- they were young, they only had the Pilates training behind them yet they were running this amazing business and had incredible confidence and knowledge in the body, which astounded me because they weren’t Physios, they weren’t Osteos, they didn’t have that kind of background, and yet they were achieving great things with a big client base. They were really generous with their knowledge. So it was a very easy learning environment. I was very lucky to work with James de Silva at the studio I worked in London. He now owns and runs Garuda which is another fabulous body movement -based study in itself. He was always great fun to work with, very creative with his choreography and his movement, and really generous with his knowledge.
And then my favorite people that I’ve worked with have been people that I trained with at the same time then the people I met when I came out here, we all trained in Gyrotonics together at the same time- which I found really hard. I loved watching everyone else do these beautiful movements, but I found it very hard to understand the basis of the movements, but I found my Pilates friends who also did it, they could explain it to me really well and I have maintained such a close relationship and they have gone more into the Gyrotonics now, amazing body workers. We always have the most fun nerding out, catching up drinking wine and supposed to be having a social. And before we know it, we are totally talking Pilates, Gyrotonic! " Hey, did you know this? Have you found this movement? This is really good with clients". Anyone else suddenly starts moving away from us because it was so boring for everybody else, but we’re just really loving, you know, we’ve just got that same thought process- and then we always laugh about what books you’ve got beside are bed and what we’re reading and that’s what keeps it alive as well. Sometimes when you’re working you’re having fun, but it’s only, if you keep learning, you’ve got something different to try. So that’s a mix of the people that I’ve really enjoyed.
And then of course, one of the most important people in my Pilates life, is Mollie Joyce who crazily enough, if it hadn’t been for her, I would never have bought into the Pilates Centre Mosman, but we were both crazy young Pilates instructors who had no intention of owning a studio, but for some reason we both banded together and before we knew it, we’d taken over a very well-established successful Pilates studio that we loved the clients and we were working there. And we suddenly became business women as well. So it was a real mix. Mollie really shaped my whole career in learning how to be brave, jump into the whole idea of owning a studio and learn on the way. We definitely didn’t go into it with any skills whatsoever- I don’t recommend it!
Bruce Hildebrand: Sounds like a really formative time for you.
Jakki Tobin: Absolutely. And I had a one-year-old
Bruce Hildebrand: Can you tell us a bit more about The Pilates Centre Mosman?
Jakki Tobin: Mollie and I were working for an amazing Pilates instructor Dell-Marie Day who set up the Pilates Centre Mosman way back I think in 1984 sometime around there. She was one of the first group of people to come out from London – this is my understanding and set up Pilates in Sydney. I think they trained in London, they came out that’s my memory. I could get it wrong, but she was definitely at the first wave of Pilates in Sydney. And I think the story goes that she set up in a Sports Physicians broom cupboard- he gave her that much space. She managed and then started seeing some of his clients for him and they were getting great results. And then before she knew it, she was getting a whole room and then she got her own studio and then it just got bigger and bigger. Then she was hiring staff and I think at some point the whole running the business was not fun for her anymore. Mollie and I were both working hard for her at that time and the two of us took it on and worked together for five years starting to build. It was at that point we added the Reformer beds- we started what were called then the Allegro classes- which are of course the really commercialized popular classes now. But we’ve maintained the studio space and we also have a privates room – so we’re a big studio- where you can have a whole diversity of clients, and that’s what we really love at our studio, and I’ve always wanted to maintain. That variety of clients in ability, in age and in health. I love the fact that we have people with Parkinson’s, people with cancer, they feel comfortable coming in. They feel happy coming for their workout, and love as a Physio that it’s a beautiful space to come into where healthy people come. I know if I had something I would want to feel normal and be able to go into a space where you can feel that you’re working out safely and it looks like a normal space. You’ve got all the healthy people coming in too. I have this favorite memory we had some NRL players at once and we have this beautiful client who’s a amputee and she’s in her seventies, she’s got one leg and she was doing the mermaid on the Reformer, facing him doing the mermaid on the Reformer- and they were having a chat and she had better form than him.
It was great. So there’s no competition, everyone’s in it for themselves and for the learning experience and we try and maintain that. It’s a great space to be in and it works for me because I can do my very detailed, small stuff, and as soon as people don’t need me anymore, I say goodbye and let them go into their studio and work on their own with an instructor and let the movement get bigger. And then they get walked to the Reformer room where they get to work even harder and their confidence just builds from there. I love the studio! Working by myself all the time, I would get bored or I would lose the passion- whereas having the variety is what you get from working in a big studio.
Bruce Hildebrand: Really inspiring story. So around 2004, I think that might’ve been when you and I first met- when you first did your Gyrotonic training in Melbourne?
Jakki Tobin: That’s right.
Bruce Hildebrand: So those early days to be venturing into this inspiring exploring of what can compliment Pilates and what can really inspire you on an ongoing basis with your learning?
Jakki Tobin: Absolutely. Trying new things- seeing what’s good out there
Bruce Hildebrand: And if we reflect through the timeline there, can you recount the time when you knew you were getting hooked on Pilates and was there some hidden gems that you’re beginning to find in both your participation in Pilates that you couldn’t ignore? An itch that you couldn’t scratch? Or perhaps the impact that you were beginning to have on your clients?
Jakki Tobin: Things definitely happen in waves- you learn Pilates for the first time, and then you’re teaching the basics of it and it’s really exciting and people are really grateful, but then you hit a few roadblocks of people that aren’t getting it and their not feeling it. Then you’ll start doubting. And then you find another few skills that you can try. I definitely learnt lots through the Gyrotonic- lots of lovely, big flowing movements, but then Julio Horvath who set up Gyrotonics, his brother who was a Physio, did a version of the course for Physios or for more remedial. Apparently they had a hospital in Germany where the bottom of the hospital was full of Gyrotonic towers. And the doctors and surgeons were so pro Gyrotonic, they were putting people pre and post surgery on there. So I was really intrigued to hear what he had to say, because to me, the Gyrotonic was so big and hard to control. How could you possibly put a surgical patient on there, but he broke it down to very small components where the body was sharing the load and ignore the injured part in a way, and get the whole body to absorb the change that’s happening when there’s a problem.
I really started connecting to that and that was definitely starting to connect to the breath more in a different way. And then over the last five, six years, I’ve gradually, taken all movement into lying down and breathing. I’ve taken all the movement out of movement somehow. But I assure you, we are still moving on the inside. I got very interested in the breath and I could see there was a very interesting power and healing component in breathing correctly and I could definitely see people that weren’t getting better and had chronic problems and had tried everything- were horrible breathers, but I wasn’t quite sure why. That’s what I’ve been starting to hone myself into over the last five, six years. It has kept me very entertained and very happy answered a lot of questions for me.
Bruce Hildebrand: Can you tell us about some of the challenges that you had in this stage of your Pilates progress and particularly in relationship to that new direction you started to take, I’d imagine you found that there was a whole bunch of questions that weren’t getting answered by what you knew as the central piece of Pilates. Some elements that you were curious that might be able to influence this movement capability for a client? Maybe parts of Pilates that were stopping you from going, I really want to stick to pure Pilates versus adding all these beautiful complimenting elements.
Jakki Tobin: It’s interesting you say pure Pilates- Pilates has been commercialized now- which is a good thing- it’s great that it’s out there for lots of people and it definitely has its benefit in a lot of different arenas. So pure Pilates for me is very much connecting into the mind body and making sure that the client in front of you gets to know their own body. Joseph Pilates for sure took the time to learn his own body. And he did not listen to what people told him about his body, if he wanted something different. He made a great change in his body from literally observing it and learning and putting the time in. So pure Pilates to me is about the instructors or teachers doing that work for their client, but the client has to want it as well, and be curious about all the possibilities that there are. I think I had a lot of questions being the Physio in the Pilates studio, the one that should be able to help the people who have the pain I remember this one client I was like, lie down take a breath. And she was just spasming in pain. I was like, you haven’t even started. what’s going on? It definitely has nothing to do with me- I hadn’t even gone near her yet. So thinking that there was really something even more integral that I wasn’t quite learning how to teach enough yet, or how to unwind enough for people, or there was something that they were doing that I needed to be able to instill or understand a bit more for some clients. Learning about the breath was a great gateway into getting people into their bodies and uncovering some deep seated patterns that needed unwinding.
Bruce Hildebrand: Tell us more about this breath journey and the way that you’ve blended with Pilates
Jakki Tobin: I started studying it probably about five or six years ago where I came across a course that was just breathing. It was run by a Physiotherapist. It was a five day course, so it was a big commitment. It was a lot of money, and it was not what I was expecting. I was wanting to learn how to put my hands on and feel the diaphragm and learn all these things about the mechanics of breathing and the muscles and how it’s all relating. There was a little bit on that, but she really just spoke to us. We watched her teach a course, and then she put us through a course over the five days. I was really surprised and I feel a bit stupid saying I was surprised because I shouldn’t have been, but it was really a lot about the physiology of breathing. I hadn’t even read that part before I’d signed up and paid all this money, but it was about the effect of the oxygen supply into the body, about how breathing affects the pH of the body, how breathing supports health and wellbeing. I’d always thought about breathing for Physiotherapy when we did our respiratory rotations was all about treating pathology and basically serious disease with the lungs when people are already very sick in the hospital. We never really covered off on what normal breathing was- and of course Pilates is all about normal movement.
How the spine should move, how the shoulders should move, what the range should be. And this was all about what the breathing should be and what the chemistry should be in your body. And it just set off all these neurons in my brain going " Oh, of course, yes!" Then she’d be showing something and I’d be like, yeah, I remember that when I was studying Physio- but we never even talked about it for very long, but it was connecting into so many things. I’ve just loved learning it in my own body- it has changed everything all over again, right back to the basics, you know, when you go right back to the beginning again and go, oh, here we go again. I thought I had this bit covered at least ! I’ve loved doing it in my own body and I’ve loved doing it with clients. I feel like I’m learning stuff with it the whole time. It’s better on my body now that I’m getting a bit older- it’s a lot quieter and more gentle and it really is for me, pure Pilates as well, because it gets people into their bodies, which is what we said earlier- that’s what I think Pilates is. Anyone else then teaching that person once they know what normal breathing is, that’s going to be an easy person to teach. If they’ve got a dysfunction in their breathing, they’re going to be harder to teach for sure.
Bruce Hildebrand: We’re talking of course of Tess Graham and her Breathability program
Jakki Tobin: Yes. She’s fabulous.
Bruce Hildebrand: We’ll drop some links in the show notes for the episode. I know she’s been in the game for a long time and a huge shout out to the programs that Tess offers, because it’s been a game changer for myself as well in diving into that work a little bit Jakki.
Jakki Tobin: I was amazed at how she could do so much without even she kept saying, I don’t put my hands on anyone- cause she just literally focuses on teaching that side of the breathing, the chemistry and the normality, and it’s amazing the results that she gets from that.
Bruce Hildebrand: It’s a phenomenal link of bringing all your previous skill sets into revisiting that breath work and seeing how it comes together so well for all your clients. Can you share with us some of the breakthroughs or the experiences that your clients have had and also for you, what’s been the, some of the biggest changes in your body?
Jakki Tobin: So for me when you stabilize your breathing. when you know that you’ve got a correct breathing center- that your automatic breathing center is working well, there’s a few parameters around that, that you can tick off on and you go, yes you’re hitting where you should be. When I went on the course, I thought I was fine, nothing wrong, and then it took me about a year or two years to get my breathing under control because like any normal client, I was like, oh yeah, I’m fine. I’m fine- you know- so it took me a while to actually make the change in my own body. But once I did- breathing affects everything. So I’ll tell you some of the things that are outside Pilates, because these are exciting as well. These are the added extras, I used to kind of wake up a few times in the night, I’d get up and go to the toilet and then I would get back to sleep so it never bothered me. I’ve had two kids. So I was like, yeah, to wake up two, three times the night, that’s normal wake up tired. I’d have to get up early to teach and then tired a bit in the afternoon. But that’s normal, right?
Bruce Hildebrand: And have a bit of a dry mouth as well, no doubt.
Jakki Tobin: Yeah, cup beside the bed, all that kind of thing. I always feel a bit blessed when you can sleep well because so many people don’t! Literally, like she said, I remember her saying it on the course- your head hits the pillow, within five minutes you’re asleep, you hardly move, and then you start waking naturally by yourself in the early hours of the day. And then you get up and you’re fine- you’re awake, and awake for the whole day. Which to me was like gold dust to be awake and have energy and not feel that you know, in the afternoon with the kids or anything like that- It’s really precious to have energy and to be able to sleep well- so that was a massive thing for me. Being able to run and breathe through my nose and not feel like I’m gonna pass out because my breathing feels so labored. That was another big one to enjoy exercising and not feel that shortness of breath. With Pilates, for me and for my clients, as pure Pilates teachers I think we all talk about getting a client into the zone. I mean, really, it’s not a warmup when you first see a client, what you’re trying to do is let them talk, then you want to start looking and dropping them into their body- so they are present in their body, so you can now start to move. And sometimes that can take the whole class- in the last five minutes you’re like, all right, now you’re dropped. But by getting people to drop into correct breathing very quickly, literally walk in the room okay, get ready for your first exercise, they’re checking in, they’re doing it, their dropping into it and then- bang!- everything starts to settle- everything else in their brain has gone away. Now they are fully connected into their body- they’re going to have a great workout for that hour and that hour is going to go really quickly. And the breathing has made that far more accessible to far more clients, and when they get it right, and I go, what is it? Why did you get that right now? How come you’ve got that? That is exactly the right thing to do. And they’ve got uh, I think it was the breathing. They always say that.
Bruce Hildebrand: Jakki You’ve been in the game long enough to get a good picture of Pilates- can you tell me about a specific turning point where you knew Pilates was going to be a big part of what you moved forward with? It sounds like you were pretty sold on Pilates from the first time you experienced it.
Jakki Tobin: I actually think buying the studio with Mollie was a commitment- and any time along the way that I’ve waivered, I realised " Hey, I own the studio and employ the staff and have all of these clients I can’t just walk away right now". So any waivers I had, I think we’re just fleeting and then I had that pull- I had to stay, I wasn’t an instructor or a teacher that could maneuver and float around. I knew to change this situation would take a lot as well- that’s what each time I think buried me into things deeper. I think at times when I jumped into Gyrotonic or jumped into Breathing, those are times I’ve probably been going " Oh, it all feels too much- I need something to lift me, to take me somewhere". Each time I’ve luckily found something that’s really inspired me and brought back something new and different.
Bruce Hildebrand: Would you consider it a triumph to realize that you were committed to Pilates even though it’s sometimes easy to do something different, but when you did make that commitment was there a sense of relief or calm or excitement in what was to come or overwhelm in terms of the commitment that you’d made to the business?
Jakki Tobin: To go through all the hardships in running the studio and being on the ground as well, teaching a lot, doing everything, being able to jump in and out of everything- there’s so many great things about that- and then there’s so many things that sometimes feel overwhelming. Then you get through those times and you manage to ride that wave. I’ve met so many interesting people and different things opened up that it’s really kept me focused on it as well and growing. I’ve really loved the amount that I’ve kept learning and seeing how many awesome instructors there are out there.
Bruce Hildebrand: I always love Jakki to see what you’re up to next! Can you share with us some of the changes that you were seeing from a mind perspective from a business owner’s perspective, and even as Joseph Pilates would have liked to put it changes in your spirit, in the way that you do things second nature these days that you couldn’t have imagined where even impossible when you first stepped into your very first Pilates class back in the UK. When you’re able to put those things in your day-to-day life, what do you take for granted these days?
Jakki Tobin: Definitely the mind body connection- to have an ability to take stock of any moment. I don’t do it all the time, but I know that I have an ability to control being able to drop into my thoughts, my body- if I’m feeling an injury coming on feel "Okay, I need to stop and pay attention to this". Working within Pilates or any body movement – when you paid attention to it, you actually start tuning into a much deeper part of yourself, a calmer part, much more tolerance to the many different people out there. There’s definitely something to it that when you look back at wisdom in some people they’ve got that ability to reflect inward I think when you can really process your own movement and your own issues, whether it’s just a pain in the body or a pain in how you’re feeling and thinking- you are much more empathetic to everybody else, or just knowing yourself and knowing that the more you know, the more you need to know- there’s more, and it never stops. So life becomes this constant learning journey, But there is something in it. Sometimes I’m like, am I getting a little bit too loose- because I still like being pulled to the real Western medicine. But sometimes I can’t help it through what I do and what I start learning, I’m like, somethings have no explanation and that’s not a reason not to go there- so never say never to anything. What’s your goal? What’s your dream. It doesn’t mean you can’t have it. I’m not going to guarantee it, but the more people that enroll in it and put their minds and their bodies to it, then it becomes seriously achievable.
Bruce Hildebrand: Gorgeous. If you reflect back to your twenties, when you took your first class, could you imagine you’d be at this point right now?
Jakki Tobin: No! If I hadn’t of gone this direction, I don’t know what I would have done actually, because like I said, I had no pathway. I was happy being in London playing around, doing lots of things enjoying physio, but not focused, it’s made me much more focused in one area. And that’s where I think owning the studio has been good- it’s held me very grounded which I wasn’t when I think back as a younger person and I’ve loved it.
Bruce Hildebrand: Really inspiring story. Jakki tell us more about where you sit with your Pilates now and what the future holds for you and the Pilates Centre Mosman, and what sort of plans do you have in store?
Jakki Tobin: A lot has changed in the last few years and when COVID first hit and we all had to close our studios and everything changed in the world, I really thought " Okay, this is a big change now. I’m not sure this studio is going to make it through. And whether I’m going to be able to make it through all the changes that needed to happen". Then the wonderful Shani who was working in Admin for us at the time was one of those people who really believed in the studio and what we were doing, and always went above and beyond. She saw it as an opportunity and was wanting to come into business with me. So in the middle of that first lockdown we actually went into business together- which was a bizarre thing to do, but at the same time felt like the right thing. We supported each other and the whole team supported each other through that first lockdown. And we learnt a lot and realized that we could take the business in a new direction. We had time to investigate all these online opportunities and learn a lot. That is definitely her skill, so I was really glad to have her as a business partner and for her to grow that side of things. And for me to be able to keep doing what I love the best and she really supports the whole team we have and got all of us learning that we can have new skills. Now in the second knockdown, I’m very grateful to have her by my side. Who knows where they’re going to go now? We’re definitely working on new ideas and trying to keep ourselves upbeat and focused on what we can do while there’s a lot that we can’t do.
Bruce Hildebrand: Sounds like a really powerful working relationship that you’ve created
Jakki Tobin: Yes, I feel a lot less stressed in this lockdown for some reason because I think new areas will open up. Even sitting here doing this with you is way outside my comfort zone and anything I would normally do. When you’re in lockdown, the more connections you make with people and get used to the virtual and the online- you’ve got to keep moving with the times. Exploring more into online courses, online learning, online teaching, and the changing face of how the studio is going to look with clients. It always used to be 6:30 AM to 8:00 PM, but now not many people want to come late in the evening, more people are working from home and can come out in the middle of the day, which is much better for their bodies, so you get to do better work. They’re difficult times for everybody and we’re all trying to support each other and that’s been one good thing that’s come out of it- there’s been a lot more cross-communication between studios.
Bruce Hildebrand: Jakki can you share with us what you wish you knew at the start of the journey that would make the biggest difference to someone who might be either considering starting Pilates or is facing some of the struggles that you did in your Pilates progress?
Jakki Tobin: I think when you start off, I definitely did this and it was really good. Try everything! Work for everybody who needs a Pilates instructor, watch how every studio operates. They all operate differently, especially now there are so many, I would get your feet into as many different studios as possible. Watch and observe- don’t just jump in and jump out, hang around, chat to people, see how those studios operate chat to as many different instructors. Find out what makes them all tick- there’s so, many beautiful, different types of delivering your craft and working, and you will know when you hit the right one for you, you’ll naturally be good at it- it’s at that point, you can then start narrowing it down, but check out everything first, because otherwise you might fall into the wrong kind of arena of it- then it will be tiring. Because it is a very physical job, and you’re taking a lot of different people’s emotions and pains and body issues- so you want to find where you’re going to shine. So try it out and you’ll know- you’ll just feel it!
Bruce Hildebrand: That’s very sound advice! Jakki thank you so much for your time on the call today. It’s been absolutely wonderful connecting with you as always. What’s the best way for listeners to get in touch with you at the Pilates Centre Mosman?
Jakki Tobin: Best way is to email info@pilatescentremosman.com.au
Bruce Hildebrand: Thanks Jakki. I really appreciate your time on the call!
Jakki Tobin: Thanks, Bruce. That was fun.
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